ENSL Gather Problems

loMe
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18 May 2015 - 15:40 EDT
#31
daemon says
On the other hand we are missing a punishmentsystem. If you know that you are going to be banned from the gather for a certain amout of time if you dont stick to the rules people would pay more attention. It would be annoying for admins to watch over every gather-game so a voting system for the people playing in the gather would be perfect. If you can downvote a person that didnt show up in time which could lead to a penalty if this behaviour happens to often people would join up more quickly. Im sure of that ^^
.


We have created a public database of offenses (bans/warnings) players have committed. If an issue comes up with a player in a Gather, someone in that gather should message Sephy or I with some evidence of the situation and we will handle it accordingly. We will be making a post soon about the Gather rules/offenses/punishment in more detail.
BauerJankins
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18 May 2015 - 17:53 EDT
#32
Can we please, please please please, can we just revert the changes concerning server choice in gathers? People don't agree with that change, I hear complaints about it everytime I play gathers and it just takes long to agree on a server if the captains don't even communicate. The system is simple, IN THEORY... but people don't communicate AT ALL, leading to misunderstandings and suddenly mega is still on the wrong server after having waited for 15 minutes... (IT REALLY HAPPENED JUST NOW)

I just don't see the point in having to decide on the server over teamspeak, why can you not just have the system as simple as it was before? If there are problems caused by americans not voting for their own servers (which is, to be honest, their own fucking fault) you can just decide, IN TEAMSPEAK, to join an american server instead of the one that was voted for, if everyone is okay with that.

I'm so annoyed by people being too stupid to agree on a fucking server, it takes longer than 20 minutes and delays the gather more than onehit restarting his computer 20 times...
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Pelargir
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18 May 2015 - 18:07 EDT
#33
BauerJankins says
Can we please, please please please, can we just revert the changes concerning server choice in gathers? People don't agree with that change, I hear complaints about it everytime I play gathers and it just takes long to agree on a server if the captains don't even communicate. The system is simple, IN THEORY... but people don't communicate AT ALL, leading to misunderstandings and suddenly mega is still on the wrong server after having waited for 15 minutes... (IT REALLY HAPPENED JUST NOW).


Just saying but weren't you the captain of this said gather? Because you're simply stating that it takes ages to pick up a server if captains do not even communicate so...
“It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet, there's no knowing where you might be swept off to.”
BauerJankins
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18 May 2015 - 19:27 EDT
#34
it's not only me, it's every freaking captain in gathers... have you ever seen onehit talking to someone seriously? no... it's a fact that people don't decide the server like that.
It just doesn't work the way you think it can. It delays the gathers by so much on some occasions, althought it's not necessary AT ALL

Also, there are always some people that want to have a word in server decision. We all know that there are some stubborn people who want to have something to say... I personally don't care about the server I play on so I just let the others discuss...
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loMe
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18 May 2015 - 19:32 EDT
#35
BauerJankins says
Can we please, please please please, can we just revert the changes concerning server choice in gathers? People don't agree with that change, I hear complaints about it everytime I play gathers and it just takes long to agree on a server if the captains don't even communicate. The system is simple, IN THEORY... but people don't communicate AT ALL, leading to misunderstandings and suddenly mega is still on the wrong server after having waited for 15 minutes... (IT REALLY HAPPENED JUST NOW)


To me, when I l read this, I think this is player problem not a system problem. It's new and people are still adjusting to it. The server does not need to be decided upon in TS3 even. Ideally captains should be able to type in chat on the website which server to play on since they have literally just picked their teams. Give it some time. It's been less than a week and you're already screaming Bloody Mary.

In my experience so far, things have been pretty amiable with picking a server quickly and I've certainly seen more people actually voting for servers/maps.

BauerJankins says
Also, there are always some people that want to have a word in server decision. We all know that there are some stubborn people who want to have something to say... I personally don't care about the server I play on so I just let the others discuss...


Captains are supposed to ask their team for input on the server, but ultimately the decision is in their hands. The idea is to pick the best server for everyone to play on, not whats best for the individual.
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18 May 2015 - 20:34 EDT
#36
ENSL Gathers
courtesy by spring

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19 May 2015 - 01:51 EDT
#37
Lambo says
ENSL Gathers
courtesy by spring

http://i.imgur.com/kKULMIn.jpg


+1, +rep
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19 May 2015 - 03:07 EDT
#38
"We have created a public database of offenses (bans/warnings) players have committed. "

How long will the warning exist? How to redress an injury/warning? (serious question, pls dont think im trolling)

Tbh. when i was Captain i didnt talk to the other Captain for picking server in 90%,
i gonna try to change that. But remember just dont vote me if u dont need! :D

P.S.

Ban Bubba for killing gathers , or do something else but nobody has fun with Sentryguns and Exos
Pelargir
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19 May 2015 - 03:50 EDT
#39
SmileOnDead says

Ban Bubba for killing gathers , or do something else but nobody has fun with Sentryguns and Exos


Don't let him jump into the chair. ^^
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simple
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19 May 2015 - 04:42 EDT
#40
loMe says
BauerJankins says
Can we please, please please please, can we just revert the changes concerning server choice in gathers?


To me, when I l read this, I think this is player problem not a system problem. It's new and people are still adjusting to it.

To me, I think this is system problem. Seriously what you say is just bullshit.

We had a system where everyone had an equal choice in the server. But you wanted to change it, because apparently NA players are to not able to make a single click in time.

How is a system where 12 player have to get to a decision in a short amount of time via talking any better? Even with 2 captains that unrealistically should moderate and ask their team.
Especially when that decision is highly subjective and some people just shout louder then others? And the decision it self its not that important, what is important that it has to be made - quick, easy and painless.
loMe
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19 May 2015 - 09:17 EDT
#41
SmileOnDead says
How long will the warning exist? How to redress an injury/warning? (serious question, pls dont think im trolling)

Tbh. when i was Captain i didnt talk to the other Captain for picking server in 90%,
i gonna try to change that. But remember just dont vote me if u dont need! :D

P.S.

Ban Bubba for killing gathers , or do something else but nobody has fun with Sentryguns and Exos

Warnings last 30 days. As long as you don't have any issues in that time it will go away automatically. Also if you don't like talking on TS3 to pick the server, you should type in the shout box right after picking teams to figure it out. Remember, as captain, your supposed to pick the best server for everyone based of the vote for server location. Also see the guidelines laid out in my recent post.

Bubba has been warned and if he continues to use troll strats against his captain/team's orders he will be banned.

simple says

To me, I think this is system problem. Seriously what you say is just bullshit.

We had a system where everyone had an equal choice in the server. But you wanted to change it, because apparently NA players are to not able to make a single click in time.

How is a system where 12 player have to get to a decision in a short amount of time via talking any better? Even with 2 captains that unrealistically should moderate and ask their team.
Especially when that decision is highly subjective and some people just shout louder then others? And the decision it self its not that important, what is important that it has to be made - quick, easy and painless.


Simple, you've played in two gathers since this has be implemented and in both of those gathers you were one of the Captains. Not only that, but your an admin and should be single-handedly selecting the server yourself according to the chain of command Sephy laid out. I'm not going to go over all the reasons we are TESTING out a new system for voting again since it's already been mentioned in previous posts. Largely, the reason was that there were TOO MANY options, NOT because "NA players weren't voting in time." I've already posted guidelines in my recent post about how the specific server should be selected. It's on Captains/Admins (such as yourself) to keep the gathers running orderly and selecting the server, which is not rocket science.
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19 May 2015 - 10:52 EDT
#42
loMe says
It's on Captains/Admins (such as yourself) to keep the gathers running orderly and selecting the server, which is not rocket science.

I don't see any reason to change a system that worked from mostly automated back to a complicated system that requires:
1) more interaction
2) more time
3) FUCKING GUIDELINES
4) admin interaction

I never had a case where a gather needed an admin because they couldn't choose a server. I used to be: we voted X but it sucks at the moment, lets go to Y. done.
loMe
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19 May 2015 - 13:19 EDT
#43
simple says

rant

1) No. It's not any more interaction than before. People still bitched, moaned, and refused to play on servers before. You make interaction sound like a bad thing.

2) No. It should take less time, especially when there are admins like yourself to determine the server for everyone. The first gather always takes longer, not because people can't decide on a server but because people go AFK waiting for the gather to start.

3) ....your right lets just get rid of all the Gather rules while we're at it. The guidelines are self-explanatory and common sense. Lay off the salt.

4) It's called a chain of command. You don't need an admin to pick the server, but if there is one present they can expedite the process.

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19 May 2015 - 14:29 EDT
#44
1) I never had or heard of that kind of problem before you brought it up. And I did not see many people supporting your claims that it was a valid problem. Also unnecessary interaction is in this case a bad thing: waste of time.

2) Why should it take less time with to do more? You just claim things with no basis.

3) Point being: if you need more rules for this new way, is obvious more complicated.

4) As said before, never was an issue. Especially not in a way that someone even had to think about involving an admin in the choice of a server.

Ps.: I love how we rant and below our avatar it says "Admin abuse". I should just edit your post to: Sorry, simple is always right. :D
Anyway the new system is in place, lets see if other people care enough to complain about. I got some complains in private but thats not worth much in a discussion such as this.
From my experience system like this work better with more automation because people tend to argue less with a computer then with a person.
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19 May 2015 - 14:57 EDT
#45
+1 @simple

You won't hear a lot of complaints lome, because people don't give a fuck or are too shy to express their disagreements with the changes. The only feedback I heard from the new system so far (and I DID play a lot of gathers recently) was negative, because it has no big advantage and some possible disadvantages.

I'm fine with testing it out a bit more if you guys want to do that so hard, but I just think it's a waste of time and, ultimately, this forum is there to GIVE feedback.... people won't be motivated to give any feedback at all if you keep going at it so negatively. So far I have only seen Sephy and you, the NEW gather admin (appointed by Sephy) support this idea.
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loMe
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19 May 2015 - 15:24 EDT
#46


The two of you are the only ones that have really voiced anything negative about it to us public/private, but anyways we will poll it at the end of the week.
BauerJankins
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19 May 2015 - 16:04 EDT
#47
(we are the only ones that have voiced ANY feedback at all for that matter....)
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19 May 2015 - 16:11 EDT
#48
loMe says


The two of you are the only ones that have really voiced anything negative about it to us public/private, but anyways we will poll it at the end of the week.


Everybody hates the new server picking system, also there was never a reason to change it.
But americans are known for beeing too "stupid" to vote their Servers. Sad but true.
I have seen it too often. My only complaint was, that there are way too many garbage servers in the gatherlist. If u have 2 good servers for EU and NA, why do we need to play on the worst servers of NS2 cause people voted for the wrong one.

(no hate against NA players - fooking love them)


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20 May 2015 - 11:37 EDT
#49
I am agree with simple here because his arguments seems to me only reasonable
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20 May 2015 - 13:12 EDT
#50
thanks for your feedback about that feature, i will setup a poll, very soonly, so you can vote, if you want us to revert back to the multiserver's voting system :)

It was a test in first place, so we might change the format again (& again & again)
loMe
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20 May 2015 - 13:25 EDT
#51
Ideally it would be nice to have 2 rounds of voting, so like first vote EU/NA then second vote is a list of servers only from the winning location. That or having the server list generated automatically based of location of players in gather. Problem with that is people use troll flags. Both things would require coding though :/
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21 May 2015 - 00:06 EDT
#52
I like this new system because every gather I've played in so far hasn't been on a bad server like Vienna. Usually it's London, NA East or TF. Sometimes with the old system you'd get people splitting their votes so a server with 3 votes out of 12 may win because people decided to fuck around with their server choices then we get stuck on a shitty server. Maybe another option would be to prune the bad servers from the list?
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21 May 2015 - 13:11 EDT
#53
honestly u like that cause u are american and dont know how to vote NA servers
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21 May 2015 - 22:52 EDT
#54
I want the old system back, this new system causes arguments 24/7, it's shit.
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22 May 2015 - 03:59 EDT
#55
kmacg says
I want the old system back, this new system causes arguments 24/7, it's shit.


Yeah, cause nobody were bitching about the system before that? Bejezus....
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22 May 2015 - 08:26 EDT
#56
I don't give a sh*t about this change.

And I think that people are not talking or giving feedback about this small change cause it's not really a problem, nothing have really changed, no one cares.
BauerJankins
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22 May 2015 - 08:49 EDT
#57
Says the guy that doesn't play ns2

in my opinion this feedback is more than enough to revert the changes, the only people not agreeing with them are those that don't notice the problems it causes
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Pelargir
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22 May 2015 - 11:53 EDT
#58
BauerJankins says
in my opinion this feedback is more than enough to revert the changes, the only people not agreeing with them are those that don't notice the problems it causes


It's called 'having another opinion'. -_-
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BauerJankins
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22 May 2015 - 12:19 EDT
#59
Because they don't play gathers, not because they have another opinion
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22 May 2015 - 12:44 EDT
#60
Wtf Buer :( I keep playing on gathers, but I don't see where is the problem.
Voting for a specific server or for an EU or NA random server is the SAME.
And I NEVER had any troubles playing on a nsl server. The lag/shitreg is a myth, git gud before shitting pls. ;>
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